|   Looking for "musical" subwoofer--suggestions? | Zazoo
Jul 27, 2002 11:19 AM | | Hi everyone.
I am getting my first HT system and need some suggestions on subs with good music performance, because I place a higher priority on musicality and dont need a sub that shatters my windows. My system will be as follows:
Mains: Paradigm Monitor 7 v3
CC: Paradigm CC370 v3
Surrounds: Paradigm ADP370 v3
Rear Surround: Paradigm CC370 v3
Now I listened to the Paradigm PS1200 subwoofer, but it seemed a bit boomy. Does anyone know of any "tight" musical subs out there? (Price range up to $650 US) Thanks.
Zazoo |
| re: Looking for "musical" subwoofer--suggestions? | Mania
Jul 27, 2002 11:22 AM | | Zazoo,
Looks like we're asking the same question. I am also looking for a musical sub. What attracts you to the paradigm, and what have you learned about other subs? |
| re: Looking for "musical" subwoofer--suggestions? | HiFi 2002
Jul 27, 2002 12:20 PM | | I think Paradigm PS 1000 is not bad...(IMO) |
| re: Looking for "musical" subwoofer--suggestions? | Zazoo
Jul 27, 2002 6:11 PM | | Hi. Its hard to be anything but subjective while comparing different speakers, but the Paradigms just seemed to have a very clean high end and were smooth throughout their entire range. I did comparisons against similar classes of Klipsch and B&W, and I kept coming back to the Paradigms. By all means listen to as many different speakers as possible, because what sounds good to me may not sound good to another. As far as subwoofers go, I am in unknown territory; I have been wanting to track down some Hsu Research models to listen to (they seem to have gotten many favorable reviews). I may yet go back to the Paradigm subs, but I want to make sure I listen to all the options out there. Good luck. |
| Get yer screwdriver out... | Jimmy C
Jul 27, 2002 2:27 PM | | ....Parts Express has two different sub "kits" (you build 'em)... one for $99 (That's right... $99) and one for $350ish. I have just ordered an inexpensive pair of stand-mounts from them, sub to follow. I'm not expecting mircles, but comparisons to my Paradigm Titans will be fun. Just another idea... |
| re: Looking for "musical" subwoofer--suggestions? | Doug C
Jul 27, 2002 2:58 PM | | I own a pair of the SVS Ultra and an 18" Velodyne sub. Have used one, the other and all three in my HT setup. I use my system 80% music and 20% HT.
One thing I've found is that any good quality sub can sound boomy. Room dimensions and sub location within the room can make any sub sound bad. My HT room has a nasty +16db room induced peak that only an equalizer would tame. Fortunately most rooms are not this bad.
The SVS are very musical in my opinion and for whatever reason have less of a tendency to get boomy. I've done side by side tests with the Velodyne. The SVS are much easier to move and ocupy quite a bit less floor space than my Velodyne. They are fairly tall but I prefer their looks to a big square box.
SVS has nice subs in your price range and they have a 30 day return policy. It costs you very little to try them out in your home with your gear for more than just a day or two. By the way, they do HT very well also.
Good Luck
Doug C. |
| re: Looking for "musical" subwoofer--suggestions? | arc_light
Jul 27, 2002 7:10 PM | | I have a PS1000. I listened to no other subs critically, so I really have no idea how it compares to the competition.
Anyhow, I'm not sure you can get a real idea how decent anything is going to sound in your own home any other way than taking it there. For me, setup, that is location and settings means everything. I could mess with it 5 seconds and make it go from sounding terrific, to absolute crap.
IMHO, get a loaner that has a reasonable number of hours on it and try it. I believe one will either make you happy or it won't, and you'll know right away. Just be sure you've set it up the best you could. I'm not sure a sub requires a side by side audition like say, a pair of mains does.
Keep going 'til you find "the one". |
| Try a Paradigm PDR-12 | WH
Jul 27, 2002 9:09 PM | | Hey Zazoo,
I own a pair of Monitor 7 v2 (absolutely love them!) and I have auditioned several subs so far. I do not have a home theater and am not interested in starting one; my system is used for music.
I will be puchasing the Paradigm PDR-12 within the next couple of months. It is not the loudest, nor does it seem to have as much "slam" as others. But it was by far the nicest sounding sub for music that I could find under about $800. It has excellent pitch definition and is very natural sounding on a wide variety of material. I thought it blended so nicely with my Monitor 7's, and it just seemed to produce seamless, almost melodic bass that was never overpowering or boomy. Try it, you just might like it! |
| Hey. WH | Audiophile
Jul 27, 2002 11:06 PM | | I do have a Paradigm Monitor 7v2 for my second system...
I am using PS1000... I think PS 1000 has more punch... This system is for music only... I did compare the Ps1000 with the PDR 12...but i pick the ps1000.
Just to give u a thought... |
| Started with Monitor 7's and a PS-1000 | entrope
Jul 28, 2002 3:38 PM | | And over the past two years moved to ACI Sapphires IIIs and an ACI Titan II sub. The Sapphires are now in the second system replaced with VonSchweikert VR3's (no sub needed.)
My experiences is that I loved the PS-1000 until I got the Titan II. I suddenly realized that the PS-1000 was rather sloppy and uncontrolled. Placement was fussy. In comparison the Titan actually produces bass notes rather than rumbles. It was surprising at first to hear the resonance of strings and wood in a stand up bass rather than just "thump-thump-thump". The 1000 is fine for movie booms but only so-so for music.
My next door neighbor, a big movie fan, owns it now and everytime I hear it I am reminded how much cleaner and tighter the Titan is with music. Reviews at www.audioc.com.
Other subs I auditioned -Velodyne and SVS were better but still somewhat rumbly comparitively. The Titan II is very musical though not cheap but in the range especially used not much can complete with it. They can be had used for $600-900. With a PS-1000 @ $550 I would look for a used Titan. They have a high WAF because they look like furniture.
By the way the Paradigm Servo 15 is also much better with music but so is the price tag. |
| Started with Monitor 7's and a PS-1000 | WH
Jul 28, 2002 5:01 PM | | I agree with what you said regarding the PS subs from Paradigm. When I heard them I thought they were absolute monsters in a home theater setting. However their performance on music was nowhere as good as the PDR subs.
And for the price, the PDR series is a pretty tough act to beat. |
| REL and it will cost you (try used) n/t | Derek416
Jul 29, 2002 5:52 AM | | |
| Few rooms are tight and musical (& no subwoofer can solve that) | Richard Greene
Jul 29, 2002 7:34 AM | | No amount of money spent on a subwoofer will result in tight musical bass in most listening rooms.
In my experience "most" is roughly 90% of all rooms I've measured.
You need the following tools to obtain tight musical bass:
(1) A room full of bass traps -- 12 to 18 --and this may not work well in small or medium-sized rooms because the traps may absorb too much high frequency and mid-range frequency energy
or
(2) Parametric equalization to reduce bass frequency peaks,
plus one or two bass traps in each available corner, and
move listening chair to reduce bass frequency troughs
or
(3) Parametric equalization to reduce bass frequency peaks &
move listening chair to reduce bass frequency troughs
Note: Bass traps reduce bass frequency peaks AND troughs throughout the listening room ... while equalizers only reduce bass frequency peaks at one listening position. Bass frequency peaks ARE much easier to hear, and far more annoying than bass frequency troughs, so just using an inexpensive parametric equalizer can make a large audible difference at one listening position.
The probability of obtaining bass frequency response deviations less than +/- 6dB at your listening position without the use of bass traps and/or parametric equalization is small (roughly one out of ten rooms,
based on my own measurements).
+6dB sounds subjectively twice as loud at subwoofer frequencies (+10dB sounds subjectively twice as loud for mid-range and treble)
A bass frequency response of worse than +/-6dB measured using a slow sine wave sweep, with the microphone at the primary listening position, has NEVER sounded "musical" to my ears. The typical room is at least +/-10dB.
Sometimes even +/-5dB or +/-6dB does not sound musical if the bass frequency peak happens to be unusually wide.
Large (over 400 square feet) non-square listening rooms with tall ceilings provide a more even distribution of bass energy than small square or near-square rooms with 8' ceilings. |
| re: Looking for "musical" subwoofer--suggestions? | Mania
Aug 1, 2002 6:46 AM | | Zazoo,
Did you make a decision? or have you heard any of these subs recently? I'm about to start auditioning mirage and velodynes, although I'm this close to ordering a hsu without having heard one due to the great reviews I've heard. They are available through bluewhale for $450 with shipping included. |
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