|   Hey pctower | scrooge
Oct 3, 2003 6:40 PM | | Your recent posting re John Edwards to Mtrycrafts indicates one of two positions. (A) you are simply trying to smoke out Mtrycrafts from his lair to engage in lively discussion or (B) You are a recent graduate of the Uri Geller School of Advanced Spoon Bending and are as gullible as all the other "subjectivists" If (B) is the path then may I suggest a look at www.randi.org --then type in John Edwards. I really hope that (A) is the path, honestly. |
| re: Hey pctower | pctower
Oct 4, 2003 4:56 AM | | Why is it that people who purport to be objective, scientifically oriented can read so much into a simply question.
Did you see the Larry King program? If so, how do you explain what happened on the show? If not, then the question doesn't relate to you.
I have no interest in discussing psychic phenomenon in general, spoon bending, crystals, palm reading, alien abductions or anything like that. If others want to jump into that, fine, but I'm not interested.
My question was simple, direct, and straight-forward. It related to a one-hour TV show. Mtrycrafts has referrred to John Edwards in the past. I had never seen John Edwards. Nothing I have ever read or hear of magicians, phychics or the like made sense to me as an explanation for what I saw on that show.
Because mtrycrafts apparently knows something about Edwards, I wanted to know if he had seen that show and if he had any explanation for what John Edwards did on that show. Pure and simple. |
| This is a public forum, PC! | Pat D
Oct 4, 2003 5:56 AM | | p Pure and simple.
Ha! You post on a public forum, you can expect comments from sundry persons.
I don't watch Larry King that often, and John Edwards would not be a drawing card for me. There was a Jonathan Edwards (1703-1758) who is regarded as the first American philosophical genius.
So, you have piqued our curiosity. What did John Edwards do on Larry King Live that needs explanation? |
| This is a public forum, PC! | skeptic
Oct 4, 2003 8:02 AM | | I was flipping through the channels and briefly passed it by as he wasn't a drawing card for me either. John Edwards was this guy who was sitting with Larry King taking phone calls from people and telling them that he was instantly in communication with their dead friends and relatives. No crystal ball, no hands together, no levitating table, not even a holographic show with sound effects. What do you expect for free?
Randi, who was also known as "The Amazing Randi" has spent a lifetime going all over the world debunking all sorts of supernatural hoaxes, spirits, goblins. I wonder what it would take to get him to come here and debunk the audio cable hoax. As for those who post here, some of them would require a Priest....for the exorcism. |
| This is a public forum, PC! | Pat D
Oct 4, 2003 5:56 PM | | I am familiar with James Randi and also have seen tricks the psychics use to get you to tell them the answers.
Even if he discusses the show with someone who saw it, he will have to describe his take on what Edwards did, so there is no real reason for him to refuse to discuss it only with those who saw the show. Indeed, just watching the show, we really have no knowledge of all sorts of things that might have been going on, such as screening callers, and how much Edwards actually knew about them.
I can see that you . . . or someone close to you . . . has had a great loss recently . . . or an illness . . . family . . . a friend . . . a grand parent . . . parent . . . dog . . . perhaps a cat . . . or a guinea pig . . . . financial . . .
(Slap, slap! Pat, Pat! Come out of it . . . Oh sorry, I was in a trance.)
Others have debunked claims of audio differences between cables, Tom Nousaine for one. It seems to make no difference to some of the believers. |
| I expected more special effects for a Haloween show (nt) | skeptic
Oct 4, 2003 7:26 PM | | |
| LOL (nt) | Pat D
Oct 5, 2003 5:02 AM | | |
| This is a public forum, PC! | pctower
Oct 5, 2003 1:03 PM | | b Ha! You post on a public forum, you can expect comments from sundry persons.
Of course it is, but I can set my own parameters of what I want and don't want to talk about - based on my own particular interests. If others want to debate or discuss the issue in its larger context, more power to them. My assumption is that ESP, crystals, psychic stuff and all of that has a very rational, non-supernatural explanation, such as other people in this thread have pointed out. Therefore, the general discussion is not of much interest to me, particularly since most of the people on this board probably share my general beliefs on the subject - there isn't much for us to debate.
b So, you have piqued our curiosity. What did John Edwards do on Larry King Live that needs explanation?
My wife watches Larry King regularly. I can't stand the guy, so I don't normally join her. When John Edwards was on, I had just gotten home and wanted to spend some time with her, which is why I was even watching it in the first place.
At first, I wasn't paying much attention because I believe that all of that kind of stuff is some form of "trickery", the word I used in my initial post. But, as I watched, he definitely caught my attention. First, because it was Larry King, I had to assume it was not rigged.
Secondly, he took the calls in rapid-fire succession, never spending more that a minute on any one call (actually, I think most of the calls were not more than 30 seconds, but I wasn't timing). He had virtually no opportunity to set up the callers and probe for "clues".
Thirdly, the detail in which he was able to describe things going on in the lives of many of the callers was truly astonishing, as far as I was concerned. If he is using "clues" or other "trickery", he certainly is both clever and highly intuitive. At the end of the show, Larry King was clearly astounded from what he had just seen. From what I understand, Edwards has been on his show before, but I guess this particular time was a particularly impressive demonstration of whatever it is he does.
The degree of detail and specificity (including as just one example out of many, telling the last caller their dog's name was "Max"), rendered what I saw outside the normal explanations I have read for these kind of purported demonstrations of psychic abilities.
Because mtrycrafts seems to be somewhat familiar with Edwards, I was just curious if he had seen the show and what he thought. |
| How could it be done? | Norm Strong
Oct 5, 2003 3:15 PM | | When I see a magician or psychic do a trick, I don't try to figure out how he did it. I try to figure out how he COULD have done it. In this case, it's easy.
Who was Edwards talking to, and how do you know? He may have been talking to an assistant. IOW, since we don't know who was on the other end of the line, it shouldn't be surprising that Edwards knew his dog's name was Max. |
| How could it be done? | pctower
Oct 5, 2003 9:19 PM | | b Who was Edwards talking to, and how do you know? He may have been talking to an assistant. IOW, since we don't know who was on the other end of the line, it shouldn't be surprising that Edwards knew his dog's name was Max.
That was just one of many callers and one of many similar examples. The callers, I assume, all were processed through Larry King's normal screening format. I have no guaranty Larry wasn't helping him fake it, but, in my opinion, one would really be stretching to suggest that may have occured. |
| BTW | pctower
Oct 4, 2003 5:44 AM | | I re-read your question and I believe I over-reacted. You did give me two choices. Mtrycrafts has demonstrated that he is an intelligent, knowledgeable and thoughtful person, so my answer to your question is "A".
And I did as you suggested, and found little that I thought addressed what I observed on the particular Larry King show that I referred to. |
| A lesson in human nature.... | Monstrous Mike
Oct 6, 2003 10:04 AM | | I may have related this story already, but here goes.
The man's name is Peter Popoff (Google it for more info). He is a TV evangelist and faith healer. His method was exposed by James Randi in the late 80s. What he basically did is have a receiver in his ear and got info on audience members from his wife, who did informal discussions garnering personal information.
To the flock, it appeared that Mr. Popoff knew who the people were and what their ailments were as well some other personal info. It took Randi and a team of about 60 volunteers around 6 months to gather enough evidence to go public.
So as you can see, it really takes quite a bit of effort to expose a fraudster and this was done without any independent funding (although Randi did profit with increased book sales).
And here's the human nature part. Popoff is doing the exact same thing, right now yeseterday today and tomorrow on TV and radio. That is simply amazing. What does it say about these people who attend and giving millions to this guy.
Well, like cable believers, as long they're happy I guess it's okay. Alright, alright, sorry about that analogy as cable sonics have not been debunked as decisively as Popoff has. But given human nature, I doubt it would even matter. |
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