|   American Beauty - most messed up movie of all time - | blahman
Apr 8, 2001 2:59 AM | | Talk about a degrading experience. all it is a chronicle of one man's fall from grace. Very stupid. |
| re: American Beauty - most messed up movie of all time - | Daigoro
Apr 8, 2001 1:55 PM | | I agree, American Beauty was extremely overrated.
Now...if you want to see a REALLY messed up movie, check out 'Happiness', 'Your Friends and Neighbors', and 'In the Company of Men.' |
| In the company of men. . . . | Tyson
Apr 8, 2001 3:49 PM | | What a terrific movie. Wow, Chad turns out to be so much worse in the end than you ever imagined. Talk about a sociopathic SOB. |
| Forgot one more | Daigoro
Apr 9, 2001 9:55 PM | | Bitter Moon is one of the blackest comedies ever made. That movie is just plain MEAN! Even more effective because it starts off like a sappy love story. Boy is that misleading. Polanski is the original twisted director. |
| I agree | Max
Apr 9, 2001 6:40 AM | | I bought it sight unseen based on its awards, and I was disappointed. I knew that I would never intentionally view it again, so I sold it on Half.com. |
| Happiness - most messed up movie of all time - | blahman
Apr 9, 2001 4:35 PM | | It's not that i don't get it. but I just don't like the whole theme.
What of a man's responciblity to the family? |
| What? | Troy
Apr 9, 2001 8:44 AM | | "a chronicle of one man's fall from grace"
No way. The way I figure it, the movie's a story showing the spiritual growth of the Spacey character combined with a classic lolita story. The movie opens with him as a weak pu$$ywhipped total loser and ends with him dying a happy and complete man. When he died, he was in more control of his life and emotions than he had ever been in his life. He had grown out of the oppressive life he was living and was able to work through his obsession with the young girl in a very morally correct and humanistic way. In the other movies you mention, Spacy's character would have boned her for sure. If some viewers thought that he *should* have boned her . . . were talking about their fall from grace rather than Spacey's.
I loved the music, I loved the fact that the smartest character in the movie was the pot head / dealer. I loved the ironic way the film showed that things are not what they seem (without the bleak and relentlessly depressing nature of Todd Soldenz's heavy handed movies) in a similar way to Lynch's best work.
Comparison to movies like the ones you're mentioning ("Election" is another one) is quite a stretch. I really had a sense of contentment afer AB, whereas the others left me depressesed and feeling like I need a shower. SImilar genre I suppose, but AB is by far, the best of the bunch because it was much more subtle. |
| Couldn't agree more Troy...nt | DaveP
Apr 9, 2001 10:42 AM | | nt |
| Sometimes there's so much beauty in the world...I can't stand it | Daigoro
Apr 9, 2001 11:55 AM | | Blaawaahhahaggghhhh!!!! Gag! Gag! (blows some more chunks)
This is good writing? Self indulgent crap IMHO. Maybe I just dealt with too many of these deep/introspective posers in art school. Anyway, I didn't find one single character in American Beauty to be believable and every scene seemed to be tailored to further plot contrivances rather than furthering the story. |
| Sometimes there's so much beauty in the world...I can't stand it | Troy
Apr 9, 2001 2:28 PM | | See, I didn't get that the "Sometimes there's so much beauty in the world" thing you're talking in AB, while definitely part of the story, was the main theme at all! I got a sense of people taking responsability for their actions, or paying the consequences of not doing it. Everyone in the movie has their own "moment of clarity" which is an extremely rare thing in a major Hollywood movie. Similar theme to "Magnolia" (a much closer parallel than Happiness), but AB again, is much more entertaining as a movie.
The characters in AB were just as believable as the characters in Happiness or Election too. I liked the growth of the characters in AB much more though. All the characters were much wiser and well rounded by the 3rd act, just like real people are.
Call me a pollyanna (or a poser) if ya like, but movies are entertainment. Not much to call entertaining in those other 2 movies near as I can see.
Sad to hear that you think that people who are deep thinkers or have an introspective nature are posers. Key-rist man, why get out of bed in the morning if you feel that way? Life DOESN'T suck as much as Todd Soldonz wants us to think it does! The idea is to work through the shit in life and live for the positve stuff, not wallow and revel in the garbage. Thank god not *everyone* is that jaded or there'd a whole lot more people going postal in the world than there already is. |
| Sometimes there's so much beauty in the world...I can't stand it | Tyson
Apr 9, 2001 4:12 PM | | Your last paragraph reminds me of a line in the great sleeper movie "The Minus Man", where the main character (a serial killer) in a voice over says "I am not suprised there is so much violence in the world. I am suprised there is so little". Just goes to show you that the way you look at the world defines your world. |
| Sometimes there's so much beauty in the world...I can't stand it | Daigoro
Apr 9, 2001 10:16 PM | | The line about "so much beauty..." is just an example of the self-serving dialogue that is chock-a-block in AB. I never said it was the main theme. I also don't have anything against deep thinkers or people with an introspective nature. I have a problem with high school kids in movies making "deep" statements like "there's so much beauty..." with a straight face. I may as well follow that with some of Jewel's poetry.
I agree that the characters in Happiness are just as unbelievable, but then, that movie is simply an exploration of dysfunction and depravity. It never presented itself as an "important" movie and doesn't have the pomposity of AB. If I want to watch a movie that truly examines the decline of the American family and seeing consequences for your actions I'll pull out my copy of The Ice Storm.
Don't get me, wrong; I do enjoy Kevin Spacey when he's on a roll. Swimming with Sharks was loads of fun and he was great in Seven. I just can't stand movies that have to hit you over the head with a message repeatedly just like you can't stand music with political messages. Fair enough? |
| Sometimes there's so much beauty in your posts | Troy
Apr 9, 2001 10:26 PM | | <"Don't get me, wrong; I do enjoy Kevin Spacey when he's on a roll. Swimming with Sharks was loads of fun and he was great in Seven. I just can't stand movies that have to hit you over the head with a message repeatedly just like you can't stand music with political messages. Fair enough?">
Beauty! Nice cross boards reference there. It kinda does seem like I may be playing it both ways, huh? I think that you can get away with a whole lot more of a "message" in film that you can in a 3 minute rock song. But that's just me.
Most definitely, "Fair enough" is absolutely right! |
| The Ice Storm | puffum
Apr 10, 2001 6:59 AM | | Doesn't that movie make you wonder what the Brady's (Mike, Carol, and the kids) were really up to? |
| Anyone that thought American Beauty "sucked".... | sumdumgi
Apr 9, 2001 9:15 PM | | Most obviously MISSED the message. My explanation for this is either ADD/ADHD, you were expecting entirely something else, you don't possess the capacity to see into a movie beyond the straight forward points of the lay simpleton's: "car blow up. big boom. man get shot. ouch. blood everywhere. ooooo!", or your expectations for a good film are so high that you piss all over Speilberg. Whatever it is, I hope I never get to that point where I see AB as a "crappy" movie. |
| Anyone that thought American Beauty "sucked".... | Max
Apr 10, 2001 6:32 AM | | We are all entitled to our opinions, but let me explain how I came to my conclusion. I bought this movie not knowing anything about the story, just that it was up for several awards. I usually do not buy a movie without first seeing it at the theater, but thought what the hell.
First, I agree with what Troy wrote above about the meaning of the movie. It is about a man that is at his all time low and then he slowly lifts himself out of it, only to be murdered when he is finally happy again. That being said, I still found the movie to be long, drawn out, and boring. I personally had no intention of seeing it again, nor did I wish to keep it to view with friends during "movie night" so I sold it at Half.com.
I guess you are right when you wrote that my "expectations for a good film are so high" because I was expecting a good entertaining movie that would keep me glued to my seat. But shouldn't you expect the same? I refuse to lower my standards. Movies such as Shawshank Redemption, The Green Mile, and Erin Brockavich are examples of movies that were also up for awards, but lived up to my expetations as a good movie. They are movies that I wanted to see again, and that I couldn't wait to show my friends. |
| I sure thought it did.... | Cosmo
Apr 11, 2001 3:07 AM | | Couldn't agree with you more, Max. I saw the first 15 minutes of American Beauty and switched it off. I was some of the worst I've seen in 10 years or so.
I agree that I didn't get the message of the movie, or the full story for that matter. My expectations of being entertained were not met, so I quit waisting time on it.
I saw 'The English Patient' with much delight, it's long, but fantastic. Just to tell you that I'm not an action-addict ;o) |
| English Patient?!? Erin Brokovich?!! Are we on the same planet?? | sumdumgi
Apr 12, 2001 12:51 AM | | nt |
| Honestly now... | Max
Apr 12, 2001 12:09 PM | | I cannot speak for the English Patient, because I have not seen it, but honestly...have you even seen Erin Brokovich? I just think that it was a more enjoyable, deeper, heart felt movie, and the fact that it was based on a true story made it even better. |
| Honestly now... | gle_helle
Apr 12, 2001 1:27 PM | | I liked it better the first time I saw it, when it was called "A Civil Action" |
| AB Was Good But Spacey Was Better in the REF (nt) | Adam
Apr 11, 2001 1:48 PM | | |
| Parents is the most messed up movie of all time. | Kingdaddy
Apr 11, 2001 2:11 PM | | My definition of a messed up movie would be a sick deranged movie that somehow keeps you watching even though you don't like what your seeing. So along those lines I would pick "Parents" as the most messed up movie I've ever seen, you know the one with Randy Quade as the father (circa 1950's Leave it to Beaver) and that whole strange what's for dinner, "Leftovers", What was it before it was leftovers? I thought at the beginning of the movie this was going to be a campy funny movie then it just started getting weird with all the cannibalistic overtones and the scene with Randy Quade and his wife having sex on a tarp (in the living room) with a fresh cadaver all splayed open and rolling in the guts and blood, that just took the cake, yuck. Anyone else seen this movie? |
| Messed Up - Try Gummo or Corndog Man | puffum
Apr 11, 2001 7:29 PM | | Both up there with Parents... |
| Parents is the most messed up movie of all time. | molson
Apr 12, 2001 12:08 PM | | I just saw Parents movie a couple of days ago. Great movie I thought. really creepy. I know that if I had seen this movie when I was little I wouldn't be able sleep for months. The scene where Randy Quade was lecturing "the boy" and the background was rotating was super cool.
I enjoyed this movie alot |
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