|   Fight of the Century - Denon vs. Onkyo - Settle The Score! | AGLeiby
May 7, 2002 10:43 AM | | I need some help folks. I have budgeted approximately $650 for an A/V Receiver. I am down to 2 potential candidates (Yamaha and H/K did not make the cut). Before you tell me to listen to them, I have. I can hardly tell the difference between the two but I sure as hell like Denon. It seems like I can get more bang for my buck with Onkyo and a remote/manual that doesn't require a PHD, but I sure like the sound of Denon. I am not an audiophile so technical jargon, specs, etc. doesn't mean much to me. Both will provide a huge upgrade over my current system so the rest is details. I am spending a total of approximately $2,500 on everything (speakers, TV, receiver, stand, etc) so I want to get my money's worth.
Is the debate bewteen Denon and Onkyo tantamount to Ford vs. Chevy?
I want the best overall receiver in my price range. Candidates are the Denon 2802 or 3802 (slightly out of reach) and the Onkyo Tr6000, AVd595, AVd696. I want the best.
Help me. I have been researching for months. Denon appears better overall to me but factor in the awful manual and remote plus more wattage from the Onkyo's and "my tree is starting to shake".
Help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| re: Fight of the Century - Denon vs. Onkyo - Settle The Score! | midfiman
May 7, 2002 11:14 AM | | You have already answered your question!
I feel that the extra wattage the Onkyo will offer you will be negligable. Manual smanual! Heck, trying is the best way to learn, screw the manual! As far as the remote goes, live with it. You will learn to use it in a few days and then you will know it inside out. The Denon remotes really aren't as bad as they look and are quite easy to use once you figure out what you're doing. <b>You like the sound of the Denon, that's most important thing.</b> There is your answer!
BTW - why have you not listened to Marantz? I would have it be a toss up between the 2802 and the SR5200 or SR6200, both exceptionally sounding recievers. |
| re: Fight of the Century - Denon vs. Onkyo - Settle The Score! | AGLeiby
May 7, 2002 11:22 AM | | I never really considered the Marantz. Mistake huh?
Forget what I think, Denon is clearly better than Onkyo right? |
| re: Fight of the Century - Denon vs. Onkyo - Settle The Score! | midfiman
May 7, 2002 11:37 AM | | A. You should DEFINATELY consider Marantz. I'm not saying whether it's better or not, that's you're choice to make, but it would be a mistake not to at least listen to before purchasing.
B. Denon is not clearly better than Onkyo all the time. But in your case, it most definately is. YOU SAID SO! You said it sounds BETTER!!!! That's your answer friend! |
| re: Fight of the Century - Denon vs. Onkyo - Settle The Score! | Woochifer
May 7, 2002 11:51 AM | | First off, the best in any class depends on your priorities. Since most of the receivers at each price point have roughly the same features and the same power, you're really going on the basis of more emotional and esoteric stuff.
Sounds like you're wedded to Denon and only a total knockout punch by another contender will change your mind. If you really want Denon, I say go with it. It's a good make and whatever model you buy, it should have more than enough to keep you happy. To me, Onkyos are very good units and they put a very sensible set of features into their receivers, but from my personal experience I view their quality as a step below Denon and Yamaha.
When I started my receiver hunt last year, Yamaha was the favorite going in. I'd been a happy customer for 14 years and my friend who sold both Yamaha and Denon recommended Yamaha as well on the basis of their reliability. All the other brands had the burden of convincing me otherwise. They didn't, and I've been very happy with my purchase for over a year now.
Don't worry if you can't tell any difference in sound quality, that's not your imagination. My experience has been that you will hear subtle differences in sound quality, at best, between comparably priced AV receivers. Given how closely contended the better receivers are, that may be enough to sway your decision. Only when you jump up to separates can you really hear a clear cut difference.
Given that you'll use the remote everyday and refer to the manual when you add equipment or change settings (not as often), those factors are actually important. And the differences between the receivers with respect to things like the user interface, manual, and remote, are a lot more obvious than with the sound quality.
Like I said, defining what's best will all depend on your priorities. If you don't care about things like the features, manual, etc. and want to base your decision on nth degree scrutiny of sound quality, that's your choice. If you think they all sound the same, and want to go by a laundry list of features, that's your choice. If you don't care about features and only want something that will work day in day out for many years to come, that's also your choice. |
| Down goes Onkyo!!! | Keith from Canada
May 7, 2002 12:24 PM | | Since I read "but I sure like the sound of Denon" throughout your e-mail, I'd have to say that you should go with the Denon. Specs mean squat and the remote control is secondary. What really counts and the only thing that you should consider here is SOUND!
I've also noticed that a few folks are telling you to make another complicated decision and audition Marantz. My take on that is that you'll likely find yourself in the same situation you are now in (Marantz, Onkyo and Denon are all pretty similar in terms of quality for your $). If it's true and you "...sure like the sound of Denon", then I say forget the rest and go for it. |
| Here | beerme1
May 7, 2002 12:34 PM | | At this point of your decision making process, I would say that if you don't take a Denon you will have buyers remorse instantly. You will always be saying, I shoulda bought the Denon. I coulda bought the Denon. I woulda bought the Denon if not for the goons on AR.
Now then. I own an Onkyo 898 which is not in the price range you mention. I am extremely satisfied with my unit.
However at the price level you mention I would be all over a Denon.
Hope that helps. |
| Good advice... | midfiman
May 7, 2002 12:36 PM | | But wouldn't you suggest at least listening to the Marantz first? He may say the same about the marantz (i.e. I sure love the sound of the Marantz) or he may still love the Denon. But at least then he can say he tried all options, right? For example, i loved the sound of my Denon in 2 channel more than any other brand until i then heard marantz. My choice changed. It may not in this case, but just an idea. |
| Good advice... | beerme1
May 7, 2002 12:58 PM | | Actually yes. I would agree with this.
But I might also say that you might be more unique than me in that you didn't close your mind.
I think a lot of people, myself included tend to lose sight of our options once the heart has deemed something worthy of my desire. :)
If I could have kept an open mind, there are some purchases I may not have made. However I am more than content with what I have bought and perhaps most importantly, at least for a never look back kind of person like me, I do not have buyers remorse about any gear I have purchased.
Well, that is until I think about DVI and then I get, aw forget it. Nevermind sometimes keeping a closed mind is best. hahahaha |
| Oh, i'm also closed minded about it too, but... | midfiman
May 7, 2002 1:10 PM | | I try to preach to others to be more open minded.
Do as I say, not as I do? |
| BEERME1..... | nick4433
May 7, 2002 6:50 PM | | "However I am more than content with what I have bought and perhaps most importantly, at least for a never look back kind of person like me, I do not have buyers remorse about any gear I have purchased."
I wanna be like you BM1, I sincerely do!(LOL) |
| Nick | beerme1
May 7, 2002 7:35 PM | | You're not waffling are you? :) |
| Oh No.... | nick4433
May 7, 2002 7:55 PM | | No waffling here buddy. Had just gotten a bit sidetracked and fell for the Onkyo trap but recovered just in time.(LOL) |
| Me either :) he he | beerme1
May 7, 2002 10:21 PM | | Trapped by an Onkyo huh?
Must have been because of all that clean crisp pure power.
Sounds like an ad for Niagara Falls. Except for the clean, clear crisp part. :)
There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that if I could have swung the same deal you did, I would.
However I am quite happy with my 898.
I also agree with what you state lower in this thread that if one is going to buy a $650 receiver and then add on a $300 remote, well, one is definately going about this purchase in the wrong manner.
Sincerely
a jammin Onkyo dude.
:) |
| Remotes rock | TimWA
May 7, 2002 12:54 PM | | You should go with the Denon 4802, it comes with an Atkis which is pretty nice. |
| He says the 3802 is a bit out of range, how can he get the 4802? | midfiman
May 7, 2002 12:58 PM | | |
| sorry | TimWA
May 7, 2002 1:10 PM | | i meant the 4802 remote, you can order it from online stores or get from a retail one, you can even get the base charger with it. |
| ah, makes much more sense now! | midfiman
May 7, 2002 1:11 PM | | |
| hehe, yeah typing fast can be your enemy sometimes... | TimWA
May 7, 2002 1:13 PM | | There are also some other cheaper remotes that offer almost the same kind of functionality like the pronto neo, and some sony models as well. |
| TimWA and Midfiman.... | nick4433
May 7, 2002 6:45 PM | | Are you guys really suggesting he buys the 2802 and the Aktis or some Prontoesque remote that will cost him about $700-800 together? Then why not get the 3802 for that price alone? |
| No I was suggesting | TimWA
May 8, 2002 5:04 AM | | that he could get a better remote later when he has a little more money, which still allows him to have his hts now but he would just have to deal with the 2802 remote for a while, and if he found it unbearable you can change... |
| No, i don't know anything about the Atkis | midfiman
May 8, 2002 5:50 AM | | I just thought that Tim was suggesting buying the AVR4802 which is way out of his price range, but he was implying the remote (Atkis) |
| The Aktis... | nick4433
May 8, 2002 7:12 AM | | Remote by itself is pretty expensive and so will any decent learning remote. I don't think the 2802/3802 remote is that bad. it needs a bit of getting used to but it does the job well. I would rather sacrifice on the remote than the receiver but the point made by you 2 should be given definite consideration too. |
| Agreed, Agreed and AGREED.Tell them Keith! :)NT | nick4433
May 7, 2002 6:48 PM | | |
| Denon, Denon and only Denon....... | nick4433
May 7, 2002 3:07 PM | | Let me compare this to 15 rounds of boxing. In this corner we have the Denon 2802/3802, in that corner the 600/696/797. 8th round and a knockout punch delivered by Denon, 10 count and it's all over for Onkyo!!(LOL) |
| Nick the play-by-play man, Lord help us all! | Woochifer
May 7, 2002 3:46 PM | | Welcome back ...
You're sounding more like a homer than ever! LOL No offense, but your play by play sounds like a hometown screamer football sportscaster for a rural high school team somewhere out in the plains.
"REF! YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING ME! THAT WAS THE WORST CALL SINCE NAPOLEON INVADED RUSSIA!"
"50 ... 40 ... COME ON, RUN HARDER, DON'T LET HIM TACKLE YOU THERE ... 20 ... 10 ... TOUCHDOWN!!!!! THE GOOD GUYS SCORE AGAIN!!!!"
"WE MAY BE DOWN IN THE SCORE, BUT WE WILL COME BACK AND WE WILL ULTIMATELY PREVAIL! WE HAVE SMART KIDS WHO ARE NOT ONLY SUPERIOR ATHLETES BUT SUPERIOR PEOPLE. DON'T WORRY, WE WILL COME BACK AND LIKE WE ALWAYS DO, WE WILL PLAY LIKE THE CHAMPIONS THAT WE HAVE ALWAYS BEEN!" |
| Wooch, I'm really LMAO!!! :) (NT) | nick4433
May 7, 2002 6:42 PM | | |
| Go with your ears only and the clear choice is Denon.(nt) | swervinman
May 8, 2002 12:33 AM | | |
| What sweet Contradiction Swervinman..... | nick4433
May 8, 2002 7:13 AM | | Go with your ears
BUT
and clear choice is Denon(LOL) |
| Have you home demo'd each receiver with the speakers you are buying? | JDaniel
May 8, 2002 5:21 AM | | AGLeiby,
If not, I highly suggest you try them out with the speakers you will be buying, not just whatever speakers are set up at the local stores. Also note that the setup in the local shop will sound drastically different from your home (diff. size room, furniture, floor coverings, window treatments etc.). If at all possible, try both receivers out at your home with the speakers you will be buying (or have already bought) - then make your final decision.
Just my 2cents worth.
JDaniel |
| Thanks Guys | AGLeiby
May 8, 2002 11:52 AM | | I appreciate all the help. I know in my heart that Denon is the clear choice.
As one person put it, the minute I buy an Onkyo, I will never be able to sleep again. I am in love w/ Denon. Denon + Polk Audio is the best combination I can come up with in my price range.
The last thing I want when I spend this much jack (at least for me anyway) is "Buyer's Remorse".
Please see my latest post (5/8) and help me spend $2,300. What would you do?
Thanks again guys. |
| Oy!!! | Woochifer
May 8, 2002 12:26 PM | | "I appreciate all the help. I know in my heart that Denon is the clear choice.
As one person put it, the minute I buy an Onkyo, I will never be able to sleep again. I am in love w/ Denon. Denon + Polk Audio is the best combination I can come up with in my price range."
The minute you start declaring love for your audio equipment is the instance you should come up for air! Picking out audio equipment is a trying and defining experience (yes, at times transcendent) but migosh it's a hobby, not a wedding (not even the Vegas drive-thru variety!)! This is a good time to read a book, or go out and meet some of your peeps around the neighborhood. Once that audio obsession sucks you in, you may never interact with anyone else, other than your audio system and all of us here on the board when you need upgrade advice! It's not too late!!! |
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